I need Yeast advice for Stuck Barleywine

[brewinhard]

Please keep us updated. I'd love to know how much more fermentation you get out of this batch. Right now I'm praying for beer and expecting bread. But seriously, if it does come way down, it would be interesting to know how you did it because that's unusual.

I don't know if it is that unusual at a stalled 1.052 to knock off a good 20 or so points or more. I will agree that at a bit lower stalled gravity (1.030-1.035) and higher alcohol it is very tough to gain any more points (maybe 1 or 2) after adding extra pitches of yeast. At least that is what I have experienced with big brews. Here's to wishing you the luck of the magical yeast!

[BrewerBC]

Well just an updated. The fermenter is still bubbling away. That's a good sign.

[brewinhard]

Good to hear. Keep it fairly warm (68-70F) just to keep the yeast happy. Give it a total of 2 wks, then take a gravity reading and report back on your results. Over and out soldier!

[BeaverBarber]

Well just an updated. The fermenter is still bubbling away. That's a good sign.

Awesome! I suddenly have a warm, fuzzy feeling about this brew. Your beer really wants to be good. Let us know the FG.

[Weimer007]

Barleywine's are a bit different regarding the no-no of aeration after pitching. While in other ABV beers it should be avoided due to the risks of off flavor (beer like cardboard sucks) a Barleywine is so thick that the yeast already struggle to survive due to the high sugar content that can essentially suffocate yeasties. I recommend aeration for at least the first three days, once or twice a day. If there is nothing to lose, I would make a yeast starter, aerate, pitch.

I am currently brewing my first barleywine, a very big barleywine (hopefully around 15%ABV), and I heavily researched techniques since I spent so much money on the ingredients. Aeration after pitching seems to be very acceptable and some say very necessary. I made my own recipe (extract since I am more of a beginner) and used 18.6 lbs. of malt extract and small additions of molasses, maple syrup, and dextrose.

My gravity dropped from EST gravity of 1.152 to 1.06 in 3 days and it is well on its way to hopefully around 1.02 or 1.03. It is at a stable 68 degrees F.

1) I pitched on a yeast cake

This guarantees there are enough yeasties. I made a Belgian tripel prior to this with WLP 500 Trappist Yeast. Only risk was that the 9% Tripel may have been a bit strong as basically a 5 gal starter, but it seems to be working out quite well.

2) I stepped my wort additions

Since I had to top off the wort after the boil with 1 gallon of water, I divided my wort into santized gallon jugs and stepped the wort addition so that my yeast didn't get smashed with a 1.152 gravity wort all at once. The water for top off was limited to only the first two gallons so the yeast could get started with their business. The goal here is that I started with an Overall OG of 1.152 but the yeast never got a taste of that.

Day 1: pitched 2 gal 50/50 wort water on yeast cake (EST gravity 1.095), aerated 10 mins (diffussion stone) Yeast started gobbling in minutes. Full frenzy in 12 hours which was what I was looking for before adding any more.
Day 2: added 2 gal. 100% wort (1.19 OG) aerated 10 mins. Next day (3), blowoff tube lined with hop residue and gallon jug used as trap brown. (This is with 2.5 gallons of head space!)
Day 3: added 1 gal. 100% wort, (1.19 OG) aerated 10 mins.
Day 4: removed blowoff tube, took gravity measurement (1.06), put on airlock.
Day 8: Airlock bubbling at 15 second intervals.

It smells like heaven. Only sad part is I can't taste the heaven 'till Dec 2013.... when it should be ready to crack open.

[Ozwald]

Some pretty big assumptions having not brewed one before. Fermentation 'starts' when our yeasties finish up their nutrient buffet & move into the fermentation phase. These two can be seperated by one important detail - oxygen. The first growth phase is an aerobic process when that 02 is supplying them with what they need. The second fermentation phase is an anaerobic process. No oxygen. The yeast have gotten rid of the remaining oxygen for a reason. You should never add O2 after fermentation has started, I don't care if it's a barleywine, pale ale or helles.

Aeration is key to producing a good barleywine, however, but you need to keep a close eye on when fermentation starts & not aerate again after that point. The Doc method is usually preferred - hit it hard with O2 when pitching. Hit it again every few to several hours until the yeast shift from aerobic to their anaerobic life cycle. How long your lag takes is also going to come into play, since how much O2 you need is directly affected by the health & volume of your pitch. If you pitch directly on top of a cake, it's rather difficult to tell how tired, depleted & viable the yeast cells are and with all the other fermentation byproducts mixed in, it can be rather difficult to accurately estimate your cell count. If you took a strain & stepped it up with a starter, making wise cuts in between, you'll need far less oxygen in the wort compared to the previous example. O2 is only something you need when the cells are prepping for war, building in strength & numbers. Pitch appropriately & a barleywine isn't much different than any other beer when it comes to aerating wort.

[spiderwrangler]

I never liked the distinction between aerobic and anaerobic for yeast, because to me it implies aerobic respiration and anaerobic respiration (fermentation), but my understanding is that oxygen isn't 'wasted' on respiring.

[Ozwald]

I never liked the distinction between aerobic and anaerobic for yeast, because to me it implies aerobic respiration and anaerobic respiration (fermentation), but my understanding is that oxygen isn't 'wasted' on respiring.

To me it only describes the environment the yeast are working in which corresponds with their life cycle and activity. I think it's worth noting that as brewers we're not here to interfere with or change their life cycle. Yeast want to make beer. They'll make beer without us. Being a brewer means optimizing & enhancing those natural cycles to influence the final product.

In this case, the yeast will consume available nutrients & reproduce. They know how many cells they need to do the job & will attempt to balance themselves accordingly. The extra O2 introduced to them during this phase help this chemical process. When they shift gears & move on to the next job, adding more O2 isn't going to be helpful at all. The yeast aren't going to back up & start searching for more nutrients, they're going to continue on with their job. O2 is detrimental at this point, regardless what beer style or gravity we're talking about. Provided most brewers attempting their first big beer don't pitch enough volume, high enough viability or cells appropriately fed & grown with a starter. All these little setbacks add up & a little extra O2 can help, but by no means is it the solution - pitching correctly in the first place is. And with that correct pitch the O2 needs of the yeast are going to be similar to any other brew scaled appropriately.