saison, after 4 weeks in primary can I get it lower???

[dirtbikejunkie]

saison extract fermented with wyeast 3522 Belgian Ardennes. 1 liter starter

og: 1.051
week 1 ~67 degrees
week 2-3 ~74 degrees
week 4 80 degrees

I checked the gravity at end of week 3 and it was ~1.011 -1.012. end of week 4 no change.

end of week 4 racked 2.5 gallons into scottie and 2.5 gallons into 3 gallon carboy.

I made a 600ml starter of red star champagne yeast, at ~14 hours on the starter I pitched it into the 3 gallon carboy. after 15 hours from pitching it's difficult to tell if it's doing anything. it appears about 70% is in suspension but I don't see much going on in the air lock.


questions: can I expect either the carboy with champagne yeast or scottie to go any lower being from extract? What temperature should I secondary these at, and how long? any other suggestions to get them lower or tips for next time?

[Sathington Willoby]

I don't have much experience with champagne yeast, so can't really comment on that. But with the Ardennes yeast, I think you're limiting factor is going to be the fermentability of the extract. I brew my saison all-grain, and mash at 145F for 90 minutes. I have a batch that's been going for 2 weeks now, started at 1.052, and it's now down to 1.006, but it's still slowly moving down. I'm thinking I'm within a couple points of it being done. I'm using WLP565 Saison yeast. I pitched at 76F, let it free rise to 79F, and have bumped it up to 82F for the past week.

[brewinhard]

Yeah,

Hard to tell how low it could go without a recipe included. What type of extract did you use? Any specialty malts? What temp did you steep the grains at? Did you add any sucrose? Provide us with some more info so we can help.

[edisonst]

I would go with wyeast french saison as a finishing yeast. Its hard to get that yeast to finish higher than 1.008. Its a real beast.

[dirtbikejunkie]

Yeah,

Hard to tell how low it could go without a recipe included. What type of extract did you use? Any specialty malts? What temp did you steep the grains at? Did you add any sucrose? Provide us with some more info so we can help.

Fermentables
81% 6lb 5oz Northern Brewer Gold LME
13% 1lb 0oz Briess DME Golden Light

Specialty Grain
6% 8oz Briess Caramel 20L

* Steeped the specialty Grain for 20 minutes at 165.
* Boiled DME for 60 minutes
* Added LME to boil at 5 minutes.
* Added .5 tsp white labs yeast nutrient at 5 minutes

[Sqhead]

I would go with wyeast french saison as a finishing yeast. Its hard to get that yeast to finish higher than 1.008. Its a real beast.

I love that 3711 yeast. I used it for my last Saison (Super Saison) OG was 1076 and it finished at 1004. Very nice.

[brewinhard]

Yeah,

Hard to tell how low it could go without a recipe included. What type of extract did you use? Any specialty malts? What temp did you steep the grains at? Did you add any sucrose? Provide us with some more info so we can help.

Fermentables
81% 6lb 5oz Northern Brewer Gold LME
13% 1lb 0oz Briess DME Golden Light

Specialty Grain
6% 8oz Briess Caramel 20L

* Steeped the specialty Grain for 20 minutes at 165.
* Boiled DME for 60 minutes
* Added LME to boil at 5 minutes.
* Added .5 tsp white labs yeast nutrient at 5 minutes

8 oz of crystal 20L steeped at 165 degrees is a bit much for a dry beer like a saison. IMO, saison's should not have those types of crystal/caramel malts as they do NOT ferment out well leaving a high FG. If you had steeped those grains at a lower temp like around 150, then I would say you might be able to get a few more points lower. Steeping at 165 basically makes a very highly unfermentable wort profile. Have you dropped any more points by now?

[dirtbikejunkie]

Have you dropped any more points by now?

I checked the 3 gal carboy with champagne yeast and no change after ~9 days.