Beer Forum

Berliner Weisse is one of my favorite styles, but brewing one has always seemed to be too daunting of a task. Sour mashing, large Lacto starters, warm fermenting, and having to use sour-specific equipment. I recently read a post, though, where someone said you can simply add lactic acid at bottling. This sounds exponentially easier than the traditional process.

I initially assumed that this would result in a one dimensional, "fake" tartness. I reached out to a local sour beer guru who said that most brew pubs who brew a BW brew a wheat beer and add lactic acid and the difference is indiscernible. The only caveat is that lactic acid starts to go "good" at some point. After 3-4 months, the tartness fades and a stale sour patch kid flavor enters.

I'd like to try brewing a BW by the "cheating" lactic acid process. The only recipes I can seem to find use Lacto and have either a sour mash or 15 min boil (ala BYO's). Even if you skip the sour mash, it seems there would be a DMS issue with a boil less than 90 mins because of the Pilsner malt and no Lacto.

So I'm looking for a BW recipe based off a small wheat beer which I could pitch lactic acid to. Thanks in advance for any input!

I would just go with a standard 50/50 wheat/2 row (or pils) 1.032 recipe, keeping under 14 IBUs. I can't say I've tried it myself, but in theory I'd believe it'd be much like microwaving a steak. It'll get the job done, but not taste like a true BW... which I'd agree, a lot of the American breweries are doing. That's why it's such a treat when you can get an awesome example of the style. To try it, though, treat the recipe as normal ie full length boil. I still think I'd be able to pick it out in a triangle, but BW does happen to be one of my favorite styles. I'd love for someone to prove me wrong on that though.

Thanks. Any thoughts on yeast? I've seen a few recipes that call for a Kolsch yeast. Lastly, does the time during the boil at which I add the hops matter as long as I'm < 14 IBUs?

PhillyBrewer wrote:Thanks. Any thoughts on yeast? I've seen a few recipes that call for a Kolsch yeast. Lastly, does the time during the boil at which I add the hops matter as long as I'm < 14 IBUs?

In my experiments, solely based on 001 vs 029, the 029 is not only a pain in the ass to work with but it tends to accent hops & bring them to the forefront in the same recipes. That was using blondes, pales & browns as a baseline. Judging from those, I wouldn't use it, but I never tried it in a BW type beer. Not saying it won't be worth a try, but that's what I was getting in side-by-sides's off the same wort, same ferm temps, etc. My best BW results were to cool to 90ish, pitch pure lacto, allow it to cool naturally for ~36 hrs & pitch the 001. There's a dozen ways/techniques to make a BW though.

For my recipe I've always put the hops all in at 60 min. You're not looking for hop characteristics in the final product, just a touch of balance.

We have a local brewpub that brews sours with lactic acid / acid malt.

The difference IS discernible. Its like the difference between fountain Coke and SodaStream "Cola Mix". If you've never had real Coca-Cola, you probably wouldn't know. Ignorance isn't really bliss - a great Berliner, however, is.

If you keg, brew a clean BW base (1.030, 70/30 German pils/wheat malt or so, no hops), ferment with a neutral ale strain, keg with a pitch of Lactobacillus, store as warm as you can, wait 6-8 months. That way, the only soft parts you expose to Lacto are on your keg.

If you bottle, you could try dosing the bottles with lacto slurry. At bottling, pour a packet of lacto into a sanitized glass measuring cup. Use a cheap plastic syringe ($3 from CVS) to dose the bottles with a few mL of slurry.

Remember that Weisse is definitely a beer 'of youth'. It should be consumed fairly quickly so that it doesn't have a chance to show age. Although lactic acid flavor is a hallmark, its also known that the flavors imparted by Brett are an appropriate component of Weisse beers.

I recently attempted to add some lactic acid to a lambic I made that was not quite sour enough. I absolutely did not care for the lactic acid and could taste and smell the "buttery-ness" of it. I will never use lactic acid again to add to the sourness of a beer. I wonder if they use pediococcus to produce the lactic acid as there seems to be a definite diacetyl note that it contributed to the finished product.

Hey brewinhard!
Is there any chance the negative experience you had is due to the fact that there's more going on in a lambic and perhaps the Brett, etal flavors didn't meld well with the lactic acid? I'm by no means a BW expert, but it seems possible that adding pure lactic acid to a light, clean beer could result in different perceived flavor profile than adding it to a more complex beer.