Imperial Kolsch... Not a good idea. Going to sour it

[Abouttreefiddy]

A few months ago I decided to do an all day brewing marathon, making 10 gallons of Kolsch and 10 gallons of imperial Kolsch. The regular Kolsch turned out great, the Imperial Kolsch on the other hand, not so much. I just sampled it and it tastes more like a underattenuated belgian trippel than a Kolsch (even though it finished at 1.011 from 1.070, fermented at 60 degrees). I decided that I will probably fight my way through the imperial Kolsch I have on tap (or dump it) and pitch a pack of wyeast lambic blend in the other 5 gallons. This will be my first experiment with "wild" yeast. Anybody have any ideas on what I should expect? Will the lambic yeast eat through some of the esters that are in the imperial kolsch right now? How long should I let it sit? Will it form a pelicle, and if so, should I just wait until it drops?
Lots of questions, I know. Any help would be appreciated.

[Abouttreefiddy]

Oh yeah, by basement (where I ferment) is at 58 degrees right now. Should I move the carboy somewhere else that is a bit warmer or is 58 degrees ok? It will warm up to around 65 degrees in a few months when it warms up here. I would rather not move it if I don't have to. Thoughts?

[brewinhard]

The Wyeast Lambic blend is a pretty tame blend of saccharomyces, brettanomyces, and bacteria. With your FG already being so low (1.011) the blend won't have all that much to work on although you should get some characteristics in your flavor and aroma as it slowly chews away on those residual points. The bacteria in the blend may have a tougher time actually souring your beer simply due to the alcoholic strength of the environment you will be pitching into.

Is this imperial kolsch still in the keg or a carboy? Either place is fine to add the blend to although I would move the beer to a warmer place so as not to slow down the already slow progression of this tame blend. Whether or not a pellicle will form really depends on a few things (the amount of oxygen available in the headspace, sugars available for consumption). I have had fantastic sour beers that never formed a pellicle and some that have. You are more likely to have a pellicle form in a carboy (more headspace for oxygen), than a keg which can be flushed with CO2.

The brett will have the best chance at making an impact on your beer and yes, it will convert some of those esters present in your base beer. You will need to be patient with this blend, and if you can warm the beer up to 65F or so, I wouldn't even taste it for at least 6 mos. Don't be afraid to add the dregs of some other sour beers (Russian River, Jolly Pumpkin, Fantome, etc) you enjoy to help boost the complexity and depth of the sourness and brett characters. This can also help to speed up the souring/funkification process a bit. Good luck and don't rush it!

[Abouttreefiddy]

Thanks for your reply.
The beer is in secondary (Carboy with about 1 gallon of headspace)
My plan was to leave this sit until fall where I may add some Door County cherries to some of it, so it will be sitting for at least 8 months. I'm not in a rush for this so if it needs a year or more, that's what it will get.
If I leave the carboy in the basement until fall, will the bugs pretty much not go to work at all, or will they just work slower? I would prefer to not carry a full glass carboy around the house if I can help it.
Also, I don't think I have access to any of the beers you listed. I can get a wide variety of other sour beers though. Do pretty much all sours have active cultures in them, or are they pastuerized? If they are pastuerized, will it say so on the bottle?
I'm really looking forward to getting into fermenting with bugs. It's like a whole different kind of brewing! Too bad it takes so long though. I guess I'll need to convince the wife that I need more carboys...

[brewinhard]

Any commercial sour beer that you enjoy the flavor/aroma profile of will be good to use the dregs with. They usually do not say on the bottle if they are pasteurized, but most are not and do have viable dregs. If your temperatures were reversed, meaning 65F now and cooled in a few mos to 58F, I would say you would be better off than the other way around as you really want those bugs to get a good head start on the beer. 58F is not the end of the world, but 65-70F is better. If it were me, I would move the carboy to a warmer spot so the bugs have a good chance.

[Abouttreefiddy]

Thanks for your help brewinhard. You're the man!
I moved it upstairs. The temperature up there will fluctuate around 5 degrees per day every day but I think that will be ok. I also pitched the dregs from a saison dupont. Should I continue to pitch dregs as I get sour beers (once every 2-4 weeks) or is there a point where I should stop dumping stuff into it?

[spiderwrangler]

Mentioned it elsewhere, but I'll say here that I don't think the Dupont will get you much in terms of gravity reduction...

[Ozwald]

I wouldn't be too worried about the temp swings - I'd be pushing it up to 72-75 for the bugs to work their magic, anything below 60 is going to be really hard on them & could easily push them into dormancy. Some strains of Brett are a bitch to wake back up. IMO there's plenty of sugar to feed the brett/bugs at 1.011, but it's definitely going to take some time, especially with the higher alcohol content.

I wouldn't be mixing too many dregs in there, especially if they're from sours across the board in flavor/profile. Personally, I would have taken my selected dregs, built them up carefully with 2-3 stepped starters, pitched & put it somewhere to forget about for 9-12 months.

As for the Dupont, it'll work in theory as the Brett will eat just about every remaining drop of sugar in there, but the high alcohol content is going to be a huge factor. Keep it warm & be patient. After the first 6-9 months, I'd suggest taking a sample every 90 days until you find what you're looking for.

Also, keep in mind that bacteria/Brett won't fix a massively flawed beer. If it just doesn't have the right profile you were after, the sourness can help, but if you've got just a plain bad beer the bugs are only going to make it into a sour bad beer that potentially is even less drinkable than the original. Once I tried it on a borderline brown ale. Big mistake. Instead of just dumping a nasty beer, I had to dump a sour nasty beer along with 10 O rings, 2 PRV's & gained an extra couple hours of cleaning.