Dopplebock: advice needed

[Neddy]

About a month ago I brewed a Dopplebock usking Jamil's BCS recipe. Mash Temp was 152-153 depending on where I put the thermo in the mash. OG was 1.084. Used a big pitch of WLP833 slurry from a Helles (vol pitched per MrMalty calc). Fermented at 50F for around 3.5 weeks. I pulled a gravity sample about 4-5 days ago - It was at 1.025. I was hoping to finish around 1.020-21. The gravity sample tasted good but I think a little too sweet. I rehydrated 1/2 pack of US05 and got it going in a 500ml starter - pitched into the fermenter (I'd raised the temp to around 64 to try to get whatever yeast was still alive active).

Its now been 4-5 days and I checked another gravity and it still looks like its at 1.025. Should I: give it some more time to see if it drops anymore? Go ahead and keg it lager it, carb it and see how it is in 2 months? Dump it?

I'm in the process of brewing for competitions and another 4+week beer taking up my conical isn't in the schedule

Thanks for the advice.

[twoskis brewskis]

You could take a measured sanitary sample (1000ml) and add 1 drop of beano or other active enzyme to see if that will drop the gravity and if so how much so. From that (and if it tastes to your liking) you could calc out the amount needed for the entire batch to get it down to your desired FG. You could even do 1/2 the batch and if it gets too low you could blend it back with the un-enyzimed 1/2.

[Westco]

Looks like you are right at 70% attenuation which isn't bad and its with in the range of that yeast. That doppelbock recipe (like most doppelbocks) are going to be on the sweet side. I bet after chilling and carbonating it won't seem as sweet.

Side note: I love Jamil, I love his books but I can't stand that doppelbock recipe. I have brewed it 2 times and I just don't like the recipe. I was getting perfect fermentation, no hot or harsh boozy notes, super malty and a good balance. But I really don't like that recipe for some reason, it doesn't taste anything like a traditional doppelbock to me. If by chance you live in the Pacific NW I would love to try your brewed version to see if its anything like mine so I can confirm wether its the recipe i don't like or my brewing.

Beings I did not like the flavors in that recipe I pitch some rosealare bugs into the doppelbock. I am surprised at how much the beer has improved by those bugs. Ended up pitching that entire doppelbock batch into a 55 Gallon flanders red sour barrel.

Westco

[Hoser]

I wouldn't add Beano to the finished beer, there is no good way to stop the enzymatic reaction once it starts and chances are it will over-attenuate the beer.

I wouldn't worry about 4 gravity points. At this point you are splitting hairs. There is nothing wrong with 70% attenuation. 4 to 5 weeks for a lager that big is a relatively short amount of time. I would stand pat, keg, and lager if the gravity doesn't change. I certainly wouldn't dump it.

You could always turn it into an Eisbock if you don't like it as a doppelbock?

[Hoser]

The other thing to consider is your hydrometer calibrated? Have you checked it in DI water at the recommeded temperature and did you check your beer at the appropriate temp as well?

[brewfuss]

How much yeast did you pitch? I brewed a Dopplebock (5g) in February with an OG of 1.079 - and used three starters / two wyeast activators / with stir plate + aquarium pump to harvest what I calculated to be 575 billion cells (est from Jamil's book). Mine attenuated down to 1.014 - but CAUTION! - it didn't really start to taste great until around two long months of lagering. It finished primary fermentation in 16 days. I did not use Jamil's recipe - but had a mix of Pilsner, Munich, Melanoiden, and Caramunich malts. I actually used a Pilsner Urquell yeast 2001 - but it turned out really well and I've repitched this yeast in several other batches (diffferent styles) - so in the end, although I bought two packs- it is turning out to be economical.

[twoskis brewskis]

It was my understanding that you can add enzymes to a beer and they will work only until they (the enzymes) are all used up. So if you add just enough enzymes you can manipulate the how much unfermentable sugars will be broken down for the yeast to consume. That being said I could be wrong but I believe that they talked about it on the last White Labs show. I'll have to go back and check

[Hoser]

It was my understanding that you can add enzymes to a beer and they will work only until they (the enzymes) are all used up. So if you add just enough enzymes you can manipulate the how much unfermentable sugars will be broken down for the yeast to consume. That being said I could be wrong but I believe that they talked about it on the last White Labs show. I'll have to go back and check

Twoskis,
You are correct, Chris White did state that on a recent Session episode. I believe he was talking about Ultra-ferm. Here is the product info:

http://www.whitelabs.com/enzymes/Ultra-Ferm.pdf

It is essentially derived from the same source as Beano: aspergillus niger

http://www.drugs.com/drp/beano-tablets.html

I am a little more trusting of White Labs product vs. Beano, which is not intended for beer. It looks like the Ultra-Ferm is intented for large batches when you consider using 1.5 to 2.5 ml per hectoliter. So to scale that down to small batches is roughly 1/5th of that. Also, it needs to be raised to 85C for 10 minutes to be complete destroyed. It is also intended for light and NA beers in reading the product sheet. It just makes me a little nervous. The enemy of good is better sometimes. I think this may be the case?

I would make sure my instrumentation is calibrated and work on controlling fermentation parameters on the hot side my process vs. post-fermentation. But that is just me, I guess.