Flanders Brown/Oud Bruin Fermentation

[HopRunner]

My next batch is going to be Jamil's Flanders Brown. After listening to the podcast and reading the BCS chapter, I am still unsure about a couple of points.

I DO understand using WLP001 for the first part of fermentation and then racking to a secondary then pitch the bugs. That would get the majority of the yeast and trub out of the fermentation tank.
but...
Jamil says for more souring you can pitch the Roselare or Sour Blend right into the primary and then leave the whole thing for a year or so.

If you pitch the blend right into the primary, what about all the yeast and trub on the bottom of the carboy?? Can you really leave all that dead yeast and stuff in the carboy for a year?

I like the strong sour beer but I am worried about NOT doing a two stage fermentation.

Nobody local seems to be brewing sour beer. Has anyone here mastered(?) the art of sour beer on a hombrewers scale?

[ColdBraue]

My next batch is going to be Jamil's Flanders Brown. After listening to the podcast and reading the BCS chapter, I am still unsure about a couple of points.

I DO understand using WLP001 for the first part of fermentation and then racking to a secondary then pitch the bugs. That would get the majority of the yeast and trub out of the fermentation tank.
but...
Jamil says for more souring you can pitch the Roselare or Sour Blend right into the primary and then leave the whole thing for a year or so.

If you pitch the blend right into the primary, what about all the yeast and trub on the bottom of the carboy?? Can you really leave all that dead yeast and stuff in the carboy for a year?

I like the strong sour beer but I am worried about NOT doing a two stage fermentation.

Nobody local seems to be brewing sour beer. Has anyone here mastered(?) the art of sour beer on a hombrewers scale?

There was a thread not too long ago about this very question. Apparently the bugs will eat up any sort of off flavors that the yeast create by dying. So you could pitch the bugs in the primary. Of course, I would never do that just because I would like to have full assurance that I wouldn't have off flavors, but from what I heard from people who have done sours, you can pitch the bugs right into the primary.
Cheers!

[Mylo]

If you pitch the blend right into the primary, what about all the yeast and trub on the bottom of the carboy?? Can you really leave all that dead yeast and stuff in the carboy for a year?

...

Nobody local seems to be brewing sour beer. Has anyone here mastered(?) the art of sour beer on a hombrewers scale?

You can always pitch your Roselare into the primary - and then just rack to the secondary after the fermentation has settled down a little, all of the trub and most of the early flocculating yeast settle out, and a pellicle hasn't formed yet.

Sour beers are being done at the homebrew scale - but I would think that the overal percentage is really, really small. I have wanted to do some for years, but I haven't pulled the trigger for one reason or another - probably the biggest reason is that I don't have the space to control the aging temp for the entire year (or the patience?).


Mylo

[HopRunner]

If you pitch the blend right into the primary, what about all the yeast and trub on the bottom of the carboy?? Can you really leave all that dead yeast and stuff in the carboy for a year?

...

Nobody local seems to be brewing sour beer. Has anyone here mastered(?) the art of sour beer on a hombrewers scale?

You can always pitch your Roselare into the primary - and then just rack to the secondary after the fermentation has settled down a little, all of the trub and most of the early flocculating yeast settle out, and a pellicle hasn't formed yet.

Sour beers are being done at the homebrew scale - but I would think that the overal percentage is really, really small. I have wanted to do some for years, but I haven't pulled the trigger for one reason or another - probably the biggest reason is that I don't have the space to control the aging temp for the entire year (or the patience?).


Mylo

Yeah, I have been holding off for one reason or another also.

That is interesting Mylo. It is so obvious that it escaped me. Pitch into the primary but still use a secondary for aging. That's the ticket!

I have some extra room in the basement but I think it may be abit too cool even in the spring and summer. If I remember right from last summer I think the basement settled at about 65F for the summer. I know it is at 58F right now so I have to heat my fermentation area to keep the carboys at 66-68F. I am going to insulate a corner and set it up for my old 5 gallon glass carboys. I have quit using them since I bought two new 6 gallon glass carboys. Might as well keep them full.

Sour beers are something I love so I think I am going to make this my quest...............

[Chupa LaHomebrew]

According to Wild Brews, only lambics spend their whole time on the original yeast bed. The flanders beers would be secondaried or removed from the yeast before aging. So +1 on doing a secondary here.

[TapItGood]

I'm in the middle of my first sour. I racked to secondary after complete fermentation (was moving so didn't have a choice), so I added a little sugar, 1/8 oz wood chips and a handful of aged centenial along with WLP655. How long does it take for a pelicule (sp?) to form?

[boobookittyfuk]

I'm in the middle of my first sour. I racked to secondary after complete fermentation (was moving so didn't have a choice), so I added a little sugar, 1/8 oz wood chips and a handful of aged centenial along with WLP655. How long does it take for a pelicule (sp?) to form?

I think that the pellicule forms between the 1st and 2nd months. You'd be better off boiling some DME and adding that rather the plain sugar but both should work. What was the gravity of your beer when you added the brett? I've made an all brett beer that stopped fermenting at 1.020. Granted it was my first attempt and it kinda sucked ass. So don't always count on Brett fermenting your beer down to 1.000. After all its a yeast very similar to our good friend saccharomyces.

Your first sour is always a great learning experience. Your second sour will most likely be much better! OH, then just wait for your third one because it'll blow your socks off. If you don't learn anything about fermenting sours, you'll learn how to clean your equipment very well. I use the same equipment for both sour and regular beers. I just clean well then sanitize well....store it...then sanitize again.

[brewinhard]

What do you ferment in Booboo? Stainless or glass?

Anyone know of any other ways besides the classic wooden dowel to quickly grow the pellicle?
What about sanitized aluminum foil over the carboy opening at first? Will that let too much oxygen in or will the pellicle form quickly protecting the beer beneath? Once the pellicle forms cant a simple airlock be used?

Love the discussion....just wish we could do it over a tasty schwill!