Beer Forum

I didn't do well in a homebrew club competition last weekend. I scored a 30 and the remarks on the scoresheet included descriptors that I truly did not taste in my beer. I was certain there was no sign of diacetyl and definitely no green and red apple or soap but apparently the judges did taste those things.

I've scored higher on beers that I personally thought weren't as good as this Mild. Now I question my own sense of taste, if I can't pick up off flavors like that what hope do I have?

It looks like I was pretty late in the flight, could that have had an influence on it? I don't know but now I wonder about my ability and potential.

But I'm gonna keep on truckin, just wondered if you folks think being so late in the flight might have had something to do with the judges tasting things like. Maybe they didn't clean the glasses or something or palate fatigue, dunno but I'm shaken not stirred.

ScottyB-Brewing wrote:Now I question my own sense of taste, if I can't pick up off flavors like that what hope do I have?

Tasting is only partly an inherent skill (people do have different flavor thresholds), a good chunk of it is learned. So don't despair. Tasting flawed beers with an experienced taster can help--they can point out a flaw that you may have missed, but pick up on when pointed out. This makes it easier to find it on your own next time. Helping out at homebrew competitions is a great way to do this; volunteer to be a steward, and ask the judges if you can taste the flawed ones.

I would expect some diacetyl and apple esters in an English beer like a mild.

siwelwerd wrote:
Tasting is only partly an inherent skill (people do have different flavor thresholds), a good chunk of it is learned. So don't despair. Tasting flawed beers with an experienced taster can help--they can point out a flaw that you may have missed, but pick up on when pointed out. This makes it easier to find it on your own next time. Helping out at homebrew competitions is a great way to do this; volunteer to be a steward, and ask the judges if you can taste the flawed ones.

I would expect some diacetyl and apple esters in an English beer like a mild.

Thanks , that makes me feel better, I just thought it was so good though

+1 on expecting some esters and diacetyl in a Mild, but they must be in proper proportion.

Take one of your beers and let it warm up to room temp.
Then taste it with a critical eye, and with the BJCP Style guidelines open. (http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style11.php#1a)
All off flavors will be accentuated. This may be what happened to your beer, it was late in the flight and therefore it might have warmed up before they got to judge it.

This is also one contributor to beers that score very highly and then go on to mini-BOS or BOS and then get knocked out quickly. There are many times I've judged beers in mini-BOS/BOS with blatantly clear off flavors, and wonder how the hell did THAT beer ever come into contention. (Yes, even with beers I advanced myself).

My point is that these off flavors don't necessarily show when the beer is cold, but bloom in full ugliness when the beers warm up. Use this to hone your process. If you can't taste/smell the off flavors when its cold, but they emerge when the beers warm up, then you haven't eliminated the root cause of the off flavor. Once you get them to smell and taste just as well when warm as when they are cold, they will NOT be effected by temperature changes during judging and they therefore will score better and stay in contention much longer during head to head competition phases like mini-BOS or BOS.

Like Drew said, try to spend some time with a ranked BJCP judge (or certified Cicerone). If you can't, then get ahold of the doctoring instructions in the BJCP exam study guide:
http://www.bjcp.org/study.php#drbeer
(or better yet, do both together).

Volunteer to help with competitions near you and enroll in a BJCP exam preparation class so you can become a qualified judge. Then you can judge your own beers yourself and you won't need to rely on other people's feedback. That's how and why I first became a judge and now I'm one of the Assistant Directors for the BJCP.

HTH-

I just had a beer judged that I thought awesome. One of my best beer that I've made, it only scored a 27 . I was shocked. The comment was that the hop flavor was muddled??

It was the Modus Hoperandi recipe for CYBI and it was dead on. The only hops were Cascade and Columbus.

All of the other comments were good and overall impression that it was brewed well and fermented well. I have no idea what happened.

It was about 8 weeks old, so I'm not sure if that was the issue. but man did it suck seeing that score.

Take a one time score with a grain of salt. The best way to really see how your beer scores is to enter it in several comps that are close together and that can give you a better idea how that entry did from many judges and not just two.
As a recent example I entered a well aged rye wine in the specialty category of two comps about 3 wks apart. The first comp scored it a 32 and said it was laden with diacetyl in aroma and flavor. The second comp it took a gold medal out of 28 entries and scored a 42 in a fairly large competition.

Needless to say this has happened to me many times and I have simply learned to roll with the punches. I do learn the most when I get similar feedback from several comps on the same criteria. I then use this info to look deeper into my recipes for minor changes in hopes of medaling in the near future.

ScottyB-Brewing wrote:I didn't do well in a homebrew club competition last weekend. I scored a 30 and the remarks on the scoresheet included descriptors that I truly did not taste in my beer. I was certain there was no sign of diacetyl and definitely no green and red apple or soap but apparently the judges did taste those things.

I've scored higher on beers that I personally thought weren't as good as this Mild. Now I question my own sense of taste, if I can't pick up off flavors like that what hope do I have?

It looks like I was pretty late in the flight, could that have had an influence on it? I don't know but now I wonder about my ability and potential.

But I'm gonna keep on truckin, just wondered if you folks think being so late in the flight might have had something to do with the judges tasting things like. Maybe they didn't clean the glasses or something or palate fatigue, dunno but I'm shaken not stirred.

One thing I would suggest for your next competition is to bottle up a 3rd bottle. Sometimes weird things can happen to those bottles you send to a competition. If you bottle a 3rd bottle though you might have a better indicator as to what the judge was tasting if you drink it while reading over your scoresheet. Just a thought.